This hi hat set came with a pre-serial badge Ludwig set. The other cymbals are all 1950's era. These hats have the small stamp dating them from 1957-59 and the set was early 1960's with WFL parts. I would consider them thin with the bottom ate 840 grams and top at 768 grams. Both in great condition with a sweet and even patina. No cracks, keyholes or dings around the edges. I think they sound great too. Did the best I could with one hand and my low budget camera. Listening to file at a lower volume helps to hear them. Please ask questions as needed and thanks for buying.